Dr. Scott Mandelker with Jeff Rense
The End of the Line -- Sightings on the Radio
Friday, August 26, 2000
Transcribed by David Wilcock -- http://ascension2000.com
[Opening theme music]
JR: 21 hours, I thought we should get together again and spend some time tonight. An outstanding program on tap. Scott Enyart is on tonight for the second half of the program to discuss the legal case which has many people talking.
Scott Enyart versus the Los Angeles police department, dealing with the RFK Assassination photographs. That coming up in an hour and a half.
First up, we are going to talk to Scott Mandelker, whose new book Universal Vision is drawing raves already. We are going to talk to Scott about Walk-Ins and Wanderers, among many other cosmic things, so stay tuned for that as we get going in just a few moments.
[BREAK]
JR: Wasn't it 1996? It has probably been three or four years. His first book is called "From Elsewhere: Being ET in America," and that was a very unique book to be sure. That, again, was published in 1995. His newest, Universal Vision, is just out: Soul Evolution and the Cosmic Plan. Welcome back, Scott, hello. I think it has been too long, but you're here tonight, so let's get started.
SM: It's been a long time, but thanks for having me again, Jeff, and I am really happy to be here.
JR: You're very welcome. The whole idea of Walk-Ins, Wanderers and ET souls has been lurking about the fringes of this whole thing we call UFOlogy for years and years.
You're really the only person, I think, who has gotten his or her teeth into it enough to really make sense of it, at least in a logical fashion, and it is all laid out beautifully in your book "Universal Vision."
There are a number of endorsements on the back of the book, Dr. Kenneth Ring, Leo Sprinkle and our dear friend Brad Steiger. Let me read Brad's words on the back of the book to our listeners, because he is just such a great regular on the program here. He said of Scott Mandelker's new book Universal Vision that it is:
A cosmic toolbox, filled with dozens of practical, useful spiritual instruments, designed to enable you to build a solid bridge to the future -- a bridge structured to support your soul's evolution in the union with the Universe and all that Is.
It is very nicely said, as only Brad Steiger could do it.
SM: Yeah. He has been a good friend of mine also, actually, even before publication of my first book. But, do you have a specific question, because I can give the listeners some kind of an introduction to me and the two books that I have written.
JR: Scott, you are so eloquent and articulate that I would be happy if you did. I will just sit back and listen with all of our listeners, so go ahead.
SM: Well, in terms of credibility, actually the first book called From Elsew
here, Being ET in America was actually my Ph.D. dissertation -- and I have a doctorate in East-West psychology. I interviewed 25 people who all came to the conclusion that they are ET souls. Now that title or term, ET souls, means a soul, just like everybody else and every other entity in the universe.
But in this case, it is a person whose essence, whose origin is of another dimension, another civilization, usually another solar system, sometimes another galaxy. That they are old souls -- this is actually the technical definition of what an old soul is.
An old soul is somebody who has been reincarnating longer than those who are younger. And the idea is that some people on this earth, and in fact I have met thousands of them, and honestly most of the people in the New Age phenomenon, whether they understand this whole thing or not, I would consider to be ET souls.
In the main, they would be called Wanderers, which means people who were born in the ordinary way but they agreed at some point to join the reincarnation cycle of Planet Earth in the third dimension.
JR: And I guess your implication would be that many of them in the so-called New Age movement, being of ET soul origin, are drawn to the New Age by virtue of their old and very, I guess, well, how many generations could it be? Their perspective is different.
SM: Right. I mean, they are drawn to the New Age basically because instinctively or innately, at a deep subconscious level, they know that that's why they have come to this planet.
They have come to help shepherd, to help facilitate, to help support the growth of consciousness on Planet Earth into what is called the New Age, which is a very real transformation of matter and energy and consciousness on Planet Earth.
JR: Well, they'd better get busy.
SM: [Laughs] Well, then when we get into the dynamics of trying to render world service, or offering Love and Light, it is very profound and deep subject. Then we get into the obstacles or obscurations of human society.
JR: Yep. I'm telling you, Jesus Christ found that out a long time ago and things haven't changed in some respects ever since.
SM: Yeah, if you wanna: you know, you and I had a really good chat on the phone before this session when we scheduled this. If you want to jump deep into this, the issue is: "Why is it that most people on Earth don't really want the truth?" [Laughs] Whether it is the truth about themselves, or the truth about their society or the truth about the universe?
JR: And when confronted with same, most ignore it and head on their merry way anyhow.
SM: Yeah! I often say that there is nothing worse than the truth.
JR: Boy, that's the truth. And remember Greg Woods of Winston Churchill, he said, "Sooner or later, most everyone stumbles across the truth, but unfortunately most people pick themselves up and carry on as if nothing happened." And he was right!
SM: Yeah! And honestly, for myself, I work now with an increasingly large number of people around the world. I have actually a website in Japanese, because my first book was translated in Japanese. There are people in Japan who are housewives and who are students and who are salary men, and in the privacy of their support groups or something, they say, "Yes, I know I am from Andromeda," or "I have these out of body experiences."
But as I keep going, and these people and I have more and more understanding that this is just a fact, and we're here and let's try to make the best of it, there is kind of a wondering of how, actually, can we help this planet, and how difficult that is.
JR: Yeah, and it is eminently more difficult because of the very thing that you alluded to a few moments ago. Let's do jump into that. I have spent many, many years on this program talking about bringing information of a truthful and viable nature to people who, in many cases our listeners are very bright, discerning people.
But for the mainstream, no, they don't want it. They will push it away as soon as it is proffered to them. They just don't want to hear it.
SM: Yeah, but actually once you get into the New Age community, and the channeling community and the UFO research community -- and I don't want to step on toes and we shouldn't be critical of them:
JR: Well, we have to throw out a caveat here, because it is a phony's paradise.
SM: Yeah! I mean, how many channels or prophets or speakers or teachers have made predictions that have fallen flat, and they come back three weeks later and everybody is gaga this thing once again!
JR: It is a tribute to their perception that the attention span and memory of the average American is about zero anymore, they don't care. And there ought to be a national registry for prophets, seers and psychics who make predictions, on the Net, to keep score of what they have done, what they have said. I can come up with probably a two to three percent accuracy rate in most cases, which is sheer happenstance.
SM: Yeah, now we could get into this kind of dialogue or this angle also for a long time, and sort of be critical of the lack of discernment of most of our compadres or the people who are both leaders and followers in the spiritual field. What I would like to move us towards, or at least present, is what the message of my second book is.
JR: Please do. All this is discussed to one degree or another in the book, it is a marvelous book, Universal Vision. So go ahead, Scott, and lay it out and we will step in and develop some things later on.
SM: Yeah. What I am trying to offer there, and in my own seminars and counseling around the world, is basically the principles of our spiritual growth. This means the laws or the fundamental ways we can develop body / mind / spirit. Now, part of that means an understanding of what the heck is 3D life all about?
What is the plan for souls in third dimension. How does that relate to our origin as sparks of light of the Creator, how does it relate to our relationship to Higher Self or past-life karma. What can we do to address the present issues of our lives so that we make the most of our life experience in this dimension, while we are here -- using life catalyst for our own development.
And then the question is, well, development of what? What do you mean, "Spiritual Growth?" What does it mean? Most people don't really know what it means. Simply put, it is the development of balanced love and wisdom. Development of compassion, acceptance, caring and kindness, balanced with development of wisdom, discernment, clear understanding, comprehension, being not fooled by phonies, not being fooled by yourself!
JR: Not being fooled by your own judgmentalness.
SM: Yeah. Moving beyond judgment, moving beyond blame and criticism into forgiveness and acceptance, but with a clear mind.
JR: Hey, and how about "Gee, it was my fault, I did that, I apologize."
SM: Right, of course. Taking responsibility. Now if you want to get to really deep stuff, you say, "How do I take responsibility for all the events of my total life? How can I take responsibility for the parents who were not loving?" Or, "How do I take responsibility for my string of failed relationships?" or conflict, or dysfunctional relationships.
Then we get into some really heavy stuff. And the question that some listener might swing in and say is, "Hey, I thought we were going to talk about UFOs and ETs. I thought we were talking about Walk-Ins and Wanderers."
Well, when you scratch the surface and you get down to "What are Wanderers?" (Walk-Ins are really a peripheral issue, and I don't really deal with it so much.) But people who are ET souls. What is the relationship between that and the UFO phenomenon? Well then, what is the relationship between those things and all of this stuff that I am talking about -- healing, balance, love, wisdom.
Well, the question is, "Guess why they are here?" Guess why the positive ETs, or our cosmic family, is now here in full force. Basically, to help us develop spiritually -- not to pass on technology, not to terrify us, not to embroil us in speculation. Basically, to help us develop love and wisdom -- individually and primarily, collectively.
The basis of the total global UFO phenomenon, since time immemorial, has been the development of love on Planet Earth.
JR: Well said. Let us pause on that note, Scott, and come right back after the first break and pursue this. I think you can tell that Dr. Scott Mandelker is an unusual mind, and he has created a very unusual book called Universal Vision: Soul Evolution and the Cosmic Plan.
He has an MA in counseling, a Ph.D. in East-West psychology, and over twenty years experience in several different Buddhist traditions. He is a unique one, and we will be right back to carry on with Scott Mandelker in just a moment.
[BREAK]
JR: Hi, we're back with Dr. Scott Mandelker, and his book Universal Vision. Dr. Kenneth Ring, by the way, who was on this program not too long ago, had this to say about the book:
In Universal Vision, Scott Mandelker establishes himself as one of the leading voices of the new millennium, presenting a vision of the New Earth that is now coming into being.
This book is for all those who are devoted to the welfare of the planet, interested in soul growth and human evolution, and who want to help in the realization of the next step of our planetary and galactic unfolding. Okay, Scott, right back with you. Go ahead.
SM: I guess, as we took our break, first of all I want to say thank you, Jeff.
I know that there are a lot of people listening who are my friends and who have been following you for a while who also want to say thank you very much for your kindness and your open-mindedness and your sincerity and your grounding and your balance in giving me a hearing, and also helping and supporting in your encouragement as you have been doing with how you have been speaking -- and that's quite a bit.
JR: Well, thank you.
SM: A lot of people really appreciate that.
JR: Well, I appreciate the kind words, and it is my pleasure.
SM: I am picking up their vibes. We have been through some pretty lousy interviews in the past. What I think that I am trying to bring is the UFO-ET contact phenomenon back to its true metaphysical roots, which is a cosmic message and a cosmic, loving connection or communique' from those beings who have been watching Earth from the beginning, and who are simply trying to help the individuals and the collective souls of humanity take the next step in our evolution.
And so, this book, Universal Vision, has two major sections, each divided into two. And it comes from the title, "Soul Evolution and the Cosmic Plan." And I think that in a sense, we can't really get the big picture on how to develop ourselves spiritually, working with body / mind / spirit in 3D, unless we know what Cosmic Plan is all about.
Again, it is the development of consciousness through sequential incarnations, guided by a Higher Self, with specific lessons and challenges and difficulties planned for each incarnation.
This is metaphysics, and this is spiritual growth, personal growth kind of teaching.
JR: Scott, I can hear a lot of people are wanting me to ask this question. With respect to ET involvement and encounters, and the abduction phenomenon, which group or groups are you alluding to that would come here to help raise our consciousness? Taking people against their will, violating them, et cetera, as you well know, is not viewed in a benign light by most people.
SM: Well, let's go right into this. There are two paths offered by the Creator to all souls for their free experience. This is again, not coming from me particularly, this is coming from six thousand years of Indian and Buddhist teaching, Hindu before the Buddhist, as well as all mystic traditions, as well as many channels and sources today.
There is a right-hand path and a left-hand path. As below, so above. There are positive ETs and there are negative ETs. There are souls in higher dimensions who have chosen the path of evil. It is a judgment term, but it basically is called service to self.
My understand is that 90 percent of the spiritual community follows the path of love, kindness, unity -- the path of service to others, which means wholeness, love, unity. Ten percent of the universe does, in certain dimensions, does follow a path of service to self.
That is the origin of abductions, mutilations, military weaponry transfers, to whatever extent that kind of thing really happens, and I don't know. But to the extent that there is negativity, or harm, violation, trauma, pain, warfare -- anything that is destructive and separative, anything that hurts, that is coming out of the ten percent of the community, cosmically, that has freely chosen a path without love.
JR: And they have freely chosen to come here to exploit and to extract from humanity things that we are not necessarily willing to give.
SM: Yeah. And the problem, you see, is there are three groups, three major ways of living life on 3D planet Earth for the humans. One is path of love, one is path of separation, control, domination, and the other one is no path at all, no choice, no understanding of what life is about. And that's why there are so many negative ETs here, because most people have not chosen their path.
JR: Easy pickings for the visitors. All right, hold on and we will take our bottom of the hour break. A fascinating conversation with Dr. Scott Mandelker, whose new book Universal Vision is now available -- and we'll be right back. I'm Jeff Rense, here with you six nights a week live, three hours a night, coast to coast with over 120 radio stations and multiple live Internet casts worldwide. I am glad you are here, and we will be right back.
[BREAK]
JR: Okay. Once again, the title of the book, "Universal Vision: Soul Evolution and the Cosmic Plan" by Scott Mandelker, Ph.D. (Spells name.)
Okay, Scott, we've got, uh, as I said rather sarcastically before the break, we have easy pickings on this planet for those ten-percenters who visit here to exploit and to cause, well, they are taking from humanity and humankind that which they feel they need, and they are doing it with no compunction whatever.
SM: Right. Well, that is the nature of the negative path. It is basically to increase self power, material type power, without love at any cost; to infringe on free will as much as possible. And we can see that, both in human society, and certain people and groups that love their power and will do anything to increase that and don't care about deceiving to achieve it:
JR: Let me nudge you a little bit further out in left field for just a moment. This ten percent that has taken such an apparent active interest in this planet of many people who are aimlessly wandering, shall we say. Are they in some cases, directly pulling the strings of the global elite which have their own personal agenda, a set of principles that I wouldn't go near?
SM: Well, you know, there is an interesting book called the Spear of Destiny.
JR: Oh, yeah.
SM: You know that book. Trevor Ravenscroft, talking about the occult background to the Nazis, the Third Reich and the Axis in World War Two.
And his thesis, which is quite well supported, is that basically the Nazis and the groups of the Axis had some direct connection with black magic or the occult. (Black doesn't mean skin color, it just means "not in the light of love.") And that they did rituals and occult kinds of things to basically gain power. And it is said that Hitler had stated that his greatest enemy in the world was Rudolf Steiner, of all people:
JR: Hmm! That's funny.
SM: :who was a great, high-level white magician, and a positive world server, and despite whatever distortions you may think he had, he was trying to help the world. And so, my sense is that only the top, top leaders on Earth would have any kind of direct connection with negative extraterrestrials in terms of doing rituals to invoke them:
JR: Well, they may not even be aware of the control that has been exerted upon them, and we always talk about Adolf Hitler certainly deserving his title, but we sometimes neglect to mention Josef Stalin, who was every bit the butcher that Hitler could have ever been and then some. And he was certainly, if not practicing the occult, certainly under the dark umbrella of same.
SM: Yeah, I mean I think that an esoteric way of looking at World War Two is that it was basically a battle for control of Earth. And that had the Axis won, this planet would basically become a colony in the negative extraterrestrial federation -- nothing less than that.
And because the Allied or the forces that at least were not in favor of totalitarianism, or at least not directly, had the Allied forces won, that they did, basically brought the planet into a sense, sort of a guarantee that this planet wouldn't be under the control of negative ETs despite the fact that they have so much influence.
JR: And yet, we have historical fact now which reflects quite clearly that the global elite, the money-meisters, were financing essentially both sides of World War Two. Now, that puts them out there in a strange group by themselves, so:
SM: Yeah, well. Again, I don't, you know, I try to sort of amplify the light rather than attack the dark.
JR: Yeah. Well, let's loop around from that and come back to center and then head on up in the direction that Universal Vision, through eloquent essays, it is really a fine book. All right, go ahead, and we do need to get to Walk-Ins and Wanderers at some point, so you're the meister.
SM: [Laughs] Well, you don't want to ask another question, because I don't want to just, you know:
JR: No, that's fine, I think we have touched on these things. The global internationalists that would subjugate and subvert the planet to their own will, and they are doing a pretty damn good job of it right now, are either consciously or unconsciously allied with the dark, and the dark certainly is part and parcel of the ten percent that you are alluding to.
SM: Yeah. I mean, the thing is that any kind of being, individual soul or group can control only to the extent that we give up our innate power. And if people don't have discernment, they are easy to be fooled by negatively oriented teachers, New Age spiritual teachers:
JR: It has always been a question on this program, have people had their freedom taken from them, or have they let it slip away?
SM: It is always a given. Power is not, you know, you see, the true power of the human being is boundless -- nothing less than infinite. The true power of a human being who is enlightened, or who has developed the body / mind / spirit completely, moves towards the power of the Creator. The power of the self is boundless!
JR: Right, which does in fact, that kind of lightness of being, it is the only thing that the dark side really fears. That boundless -- it is no contest when people realize their power.
SM: Well, yeah. And actually, the people who realize, or as we realize our true spiritual inner power, the negative forces, dark forces move along, and basically leave us alone, because they would rather find people who are easy, people who are out of their spiritual power.
Now in terms of the influence, aside from government and politics and business and all of that, it is said, and I think that the facts bear it out, that ET channels, people who try to do channeling, are actually easy or prey -- they are prime targets for negative ET disinformation and distortion.
And I think that everybody who is interested in channeling has to be aware that not everything that comes out is going to be Love and Light, even if it claims to be from a source of Love and Light.
JR: You never know who you are connecting with on the other side!
SM: You have to keep your discernment.
JR: That's what Brad Steiger has said for so many years. Scott echoes that. Scott Mandelker's new book is Universal Vision: Soul Evolution and the Cosmic Plan. It is truly a must-read when it comes to New Age books. This is a true book for the New Millennium. We will be right back with Scott in just a couple of minutes.
[BREAK]
JR: Okay, welcome back, and my guest for the first half of the program tonight, Dr. Scott Mandelker. His book, "Universal Vision: Soul Evolution and the Cosmic Plan." There are two major classes of those who call themselves ET souls. You've got it pegged down here as Walk-Ins and Wanderers. What's the difference between them?
SM: Okay. In general, most of the people who would be considered ET souls, meaning people, souls from other dimensions who are temporary to Earth, visitors here just for a short time -- the first category, Walk-Ins -- the majority are called Wanderers or people who are basically born in the ordinary way.
The Walk-In is a person who has a soul exchange at some point after birth. This is, it sort of could look like possession, but it is completely voluntary. The result of this soul exchange, in which, so it is said, the ET soul or a soul from elsewhere comes into a body of a person who chooses to leave consciously. That person leaves and so-called dies, and a new personality stream enters.
Now some of the people I interviewed had this sense about themselves, and there are New Age groups that cater to people who have this sense about themselves. I think that it is not particularly common. But the people that I interviewed, in all cases, sort of went through a death and rebirth experience -- physically, emotionally, mentally, let's say they were at the end of their rope.
Maybe they wanted to commit suicide, maybe they were in depression, maybe they were very ill, and something happened. And they hit the bottom, and they came up, and they felt like they were not the person they used to be. And from that moment on, their lives were infused with a kind of hope and spirituality, and sometimes for a short period of time after what was considered the Walk-In, intense psychic ability.
There is a man in my book -- the first book, this is From Elsewhere, Bob. And he was an alcoholic, and he was a drug user, and he was abusive emotionally to people around him. And he had a kind of experience where he went into a fugue.
He sort of became disoriented, and he saw in the newspaper ahead of him, where he was reading something in front of him, (and this was a long story, anyway,) what he read was, "You have paid the toll; you can cross the bridge."
JR: Hmm.
SM: And it puts an interesting light on his previous experiences in this life of drug abuse, and being a mean, unhappy guy. That this is a little bit like paying a toll. And so when we look at the esoteric basis for addiction and substance abuse and self-destructive behavior, it is a little bit like self-punishment. Like penance.
And in my experience as a counselor, working with people, when the person understands why they have been involved in self-destructive behavior, they generally find something that could be called Karmic Guilt -- a sense that in past lives that they did bad things.
And in this life they feel guilty, and they have been hurting themselves for it. And so, this is one type of experience that leads some people to a sense of being a Walk-In. So after that time, this fellow Bob basically took up meditation, he became kind and gentle, he didn't use substances or drugs one day after that. He didn't go back at all. In fact, he had no desire at all, and his life was completely revolutionized.
Now interestingly, some of the people I interviewed two years later, after the event they considered a Walk-In, went back and said, "Well, you know, I think maybe it really wasn't a Walk-In, it was just a spiritual awakening." So that is very difficult to determine. But the Wanderer, on the other hand, is the majority type of ET soul on Earth.
If we talk about numbers, in my understanding there are about 85 to 100 million souls on Earth who are from other dimensions. Most of them have been on Earth for a long time. Many people who have a connection to Atlantis or Egypt or the Renaissance or later just this century have come in at those times. And for many of those people, they have a sense that "This is my last life."
I don't know if we have time before the next break, but this leads us into the question of "Why are they waking up now" or "Why are they coming to this conclusion now?" And how does that relate to the vast increase in UFO sightings and ET contacts in the twentieth century.
JR: You have about seven minutes, so go ahead.
SM: Okay. The question as to why now, which you will see spoken of widely among ET channels as well as indigenous groups like the Hopis or the Mayans, is that this planet is at the end of a cycle of evolution. That planets are like schoolhouses, for souls learning a particular lesson.
The lesson of Planet Earth is to learn about love, basically -- and to develop a choice of spiritual path -- positive and negative. How the negative path relates to love is sort of another question, but most souls here have up for them the learning of compassion, kindness, acceptance of self and acceptance of others.
[Note: Ra says that the negative path is the path of total love for the self, with no love for any others.]
But, we are coming to the near end of this graduation, or of this cycle of learning. And so, graduation time is drawing near -- and that is what people call the Ascension, the New Age, the Rapture, Apocalypse, the Fifth World, the Mayans say.
The idea is that the planet has passed through a certain portion of space in relation to the galaxy, the Galactic Center, as this spiral arm of the galaxy rotates. Earth and the Solar System move into different quadrants of space with different energy qualities.
And in fact, there have been researchers, some Russian astrophysicists are saying, (and this is documented scientific material) that the Solar System is being bombarded by different qualities of energy than it had been fifty or a hundred years ago.
That prompts an evolutionary jump on the planet. But only those who have developed themselves sufficiently can partake of it. And this is when we get to the time of 2010, 2013. 2012, the Mayan Calendar says that this is sort of the end of this cycle of evolution. It is my understanding that this is for real.
JR: It doesn't mean the end of the world, but it means the end of a cycle.
SM: It means basically that only those of us who have prepared ourselves by turning within and developing qualities of the heart will be able to move with the planet into its condition of higher energy and consciousness.
And just like in the Christian Bible, they say that the meek shall inherit the Earth. The kingdom of Heaven on Earth is coming to be. And to me, this is a very esoteric, genuine teaching, and this is called Harvest: the three way split. The harvest is about this time, 2010-2013.
And what you have got there is that the souls who are sufficiently negative join the negative ET federation -- believe it or not. Those who have chosen the path of love will stay on Earth and take light bodies, take bodies that are appropriate to the new condition of energy on Earth which is fourth-dimensional, or light bodies. And those who haven't chosen, go elsewhere to repeat the same lessons.
JR: All right. So the enlightened souls will matriculate to the fourth dimension. They will actually begin to resonate at a higher level, and I would assume, inherit a relatively unspoiled and undamaged planet -- a planet that now will take centuries, perhaps, to clean up.
And that's not to say those of us who are concerned about it wouldn't take on the task, but if there is to be a mass matriculation into light being form, it might connote a higher resonance and residence as well.
SM: Yeah. Well, I think the idea of a new heaven and a new Earth is a genuine metaphysical fact as to what will happen to Planet Earth as it graduates into its new condition. My sense is that the Self-regenerating powers of nature and the planet are far more than we recognize. And were humanity to stop all pollution and all destruction of the biosphere in all ways today, we would see things come around really fast. Just like the human body.
JR: I like that idea, and it is a concept that I can take home with me.
SM: Yeah. What I am saying is, first of all, there are higher technologies that other races, extraterrestrial groups have, that could be applied today, if we were ready, if we called them, if we were truly receptive to their help, that would clean up the environment very rapidly. I have no doubt about that.
JR: There might be a little elbowing and pushing and shoving among that ten percent, though, of dark ETs who are pretty happy here, feeding off various and sundry human wreckage forms.
SM: Well, ultimately we only have ourselves to blame for that, because:
JR: Do you mean, accountability again?
SM: Well, accountability. You know, there is a quote from the Dalai Lama that I use a lot. They asked him, "What about the problems on Earth?" And he said, "The problems on Earth are problems of leadership." Meaning that a lot of the leadership is self-serving.
Well, I take that further. The problems on Earth are not simply about leadership, but the mass of people who support that. And basically don't know the difference between love and control.
JR: Agreed.
SM: And these are big differences. The message here is that there is tremendous help available in the Universe, both for our spiritual growth as well as the resurrection of our material, physical environment.
JR: But that help has to generate from within first.
SM: Yeah. We have to help ourselves. And then, we can open our hearts and our minds to our spiritual brothers and sisters in the Universe. Many open-minded people understand this already, but in the mainstream it is of course not understood. And I think it is because the powers that be don't want to recognize a higher authority -- which, there it is.
JR: Well, certainly they have honed the art of mass mind control and programming now, and they are sitting pretty comfortable with the mass majority of people, ignorant or unconcerned about what is really going on.
SM: Yeah, and that will increase in the next ten years before Harvest. Because basically, the curtain to this 3D theater is coming to a close very quickly. And time is very short for souls to develop themselves to make this graduation.
And some people have clearly made their choice of love and kindness for self and other, and most have not, to a large extent globally, because of the economic conditions. I mean, most of the world doesn't have enough food to eat. And that's, you know, you can't really develop this self-offering service to others when you are hungry, or you are impoverished.
JR: Sure. It's dependence, and a lot of people suggest that it is intentional, in many ways.
SM: Yeah. I mean, the problems on Earth are created by human population. And so, the benevolent extraterrestrial community -- who are not, you know, weird aliens and grays doing strange things, they are not like that at all -- they are basically loving beings and very mature -- they would like to help as much as possible, but we don't ask.
JR: All right. A quick Email question for you, Scott. Are you a Vegan?
SM: [Laughs] No, I'm not, and that's a long story.
JR: You're not. Are you leaning that way?
SM: Well, I don't kill animals. But meat, I think, helps my physical body.
JR: All right, there are some genetic types that do well on meat; there's no doubt about that. Universal Vision: Soul Evolution and the Cosmic Plan by Scott Mandelker, Ph.D. And we'll be right back. I'm Jeff Rense, we'll take a little break here and see you after the top of the hour.
[BREAK]
JR: Okay, back with hour number two, and we are having a delightful conversation with one of the most remarkable people to address the ET issue in a long time, Dr. Scott Mandelker, Ph.D. Universal Vision is the name of his book, Soul Evolution and the Cosmic Plan.
Scott, the issue of ET contact continues to be right at the forefront of the whole issue of our culture, from entertainment to politics. Now we have word that if George Bush Jr. is the president, he'll come clean and tell us all.
In the future, there will be open contact, you believe, with ET groups. What happens if it occurs before the big changeover in 2012, 2013, something like that?
SM: Yeah, well now we get into a can of worms. Do you mind if I just give my website address before?
JR: Please do. And let me tell everyone that you can go there if you are online, just by clicking on the link below Scott's name. But do give it.
SM: Yeah. The website address is www.universal-vision.com. And there they can find all the information on both books as well as other materials and lots of essays, and also working with me -- meaning personal counseling and sessions which I do by phone and in person, which I have done for about ten years, as well as seminars around the country and overseas.
Well, I have always said, and I think that we should realize that if those who seek to maintain their power at any cost finally say that they are offering a disclosure of the real truth, we should be careful. A zebra doesn't change stripes overnight, and as we all know there is a lot of disinformation in the UFO field in various ways.
So, I don't expect any honest and complete disclosure of the totality of what governments around the world know about extraterrestrials and the UFO phenomenon on Earth.
I think at that point we should be on even more careful footing, because at that point there is going to be a struggle for whose versions -- the leadership, or the experts, or the common people's understandings of UFOs and ETs -- is the real one.
And I've thought, you know, I don't expect any complete disclosure before this harvest or world transition. Because if that does happen, in a sense the juggernaut has been loosed, and all bets are off.
And in a sense, everybody is going to come out and say what they think is real, and there will be all sorts of doctrinal and opinion discussions and arguments about who is true and who is lying. And I just don't expect that it will come, because I don't think that it is really, it doesn't serve those who have power to say it, unless it is going to maintain their power.
JR: The potential for manipulation is enormous, and knowledge is power, and they have got the knowledge and they are going to hang onto that power. And they'll play games, they've got technology now that most of us, I think, are agreed upon could put a lot of fear in people if they were to fly it over a few cities at high noon, et cetera.
SM: Yeah, and in my understanding it is not the way of the benevolent extraterrestrials or benevolent souls in the Universe to make any kind of full, frontal exposure of their reality. Because it basically infringes on the free will of humanity, which in the main is not seeking this kind of cosmic contact.
And so, any kind of flaps and big UFO activity, I don't think is anything to cheer about -- like in the movie Independence Day, right? They all said, "Welcome to Los Angeles, welcome to Earth," and then they got zapped -- if you remember the scene in Independence Day when they are on the top of some tower in LA.
So, there may be in the next ten years much more open UFO sightings, over cities and things like that. And it may get kind of strange and weird. And if that happens, though, I don't expect that that is going to be something benevolent, because the groups that want to help us are not going to try to force our eyes open.
And that is also the way of knowing that most abductions are coming from a negative source, is that they are violations of the free will of the people involved.
When we look at crop circles, though, I think that we have, in my opinion, a very obvious, blatant, clear sign of the way that benevolent higher-dimensional beings work; which is to basically show the glory of the Cosmos, in this case in geometrical terms, and let people take it from there.
It is basically to inspire seeking, to offer the vision of mystery so that people can wake up and say, "Wow. Maybe there is something going on in the universe more than just the nine-to-five life that we are living." And maybe they are wonderful and beautiful, and maybe we can open our hearts and open our minds and develop ourselves further.
JR: Well, that's a very nice connection to bring into the discussion, the crop formations. They are truly mind expanding, and for many people they are almost sacred.
SM: I think they are.
JR: I have known people who have actually color Xeroxed pictures of one particular formation and hung it all over their house!
SM: Yeah. I think that that is basically our universal community saying hello, making a greeting of tremendous beauty and subtlety of intelligence. It is basically, to me, the glory of cosmic design in the fields of Earth.
JR: Yeah, it is truly universal, and it is glorious.
SM: And yet, one thing that I have always been amazed at is that there are not town hall meetings in every country over the planet talking about this.
JR: Nah! Not even a little, tiny, 1-by-1 color picture in National Geographic. It tells you something right there, I think, when you look at the totality of the phenomenon. It is not getting covered, it is being ignored, and there is a reason for that.
This is a demanding, awe-inspiring, compelling phenomenon that should be in every major magazine, but we have got the monopoly press and they don't want to touch it, for whatever reason.
SM: And the people as a whole don't look that way also. And so then when we get back to the idea of ET souls and Wanderers, or anybody like you or I who is trying to help the world in whatever way, through education, through healing, through just being kind, we find that a lot of people are not that open to receiving help.
JR: I have never seen more tattoos in my life. I wonder if it is the true mark of the Beast. I see tattoos on kids, on adults, everywhere! It's amazing.
SM: Yeah, and another thing about that is:
JR: I'm kidding about the mark of the beast, folks, if you've got a tattoo, I'm just kidding.
SM: As most phenomena on Earth, I think it is kind of a mixed phenomenon.
JR: Yeah, as a Ph.D., what is that? Is it self-abuse, self-mutilation, what is it?
SM: Well, believe it or not, I just gave my message at a rave in San Francisco recently. By synchronicity, I was sitting next to the drummer of a young rave band on an airplane when I was coming back from Knoxville, Tennessee, doing a seminar on a UFO conference in May.
The guy knows that he is a Wanderer, he knows that the world is making some big changes, he knows that the purpose of their music is to bring inspiration and open mind and kindness and a little bit of magic to people.
And I spoke there, and of course there were a lot of people there with tattoos. I think that a lot of the people who were doing that, and a lot of the youth who are getting into very weird things, are sort of rebelling against the restrictions of consciousness in this culture.
JR: Who is putting the restrictions of consciousness on them? When they have at their own doorstep, their own personal psyche, the ability to turn it loose, who's putting it: That's the one thing that the ugly, evil globalists can't take away, and that's inner beauty, and inner light. So what are they so upset about?
SM: Well, I think that, you know, it's very difficult for people to become free of the conditioning that they have received since childhood.
JR: So it is a programming issue in your opinion. They are programmed, they don't like it, they don't understand it, but they know something is wrong and they are rebelling.
SM: And instead of being able to free their minds wholly, they are starting to show their body, tattoo and mark their body, and saying, "I'm different. I am not of this culture."
JR: Well, when they all start doing it, though, they're not different -- they become regimented and uniform, and well, we've seen it before, whether it was flower children wearing beads in the 60's, and paisley this and that, and:
SM: Well, you know, the greatest achievement on Planet Earth is to free your mind. And ultimately, you know, first we think, "Well, I am going to free myself from the power structures and the conditioning sociologically." But the real thing is to free it of your own fear.
JR: Were you able to get through to them to tell them that they have that ability right here and now, that they can do that?
SM: Somewhat. Only somewhat.
JR: Yeah. Well, if you got to one of them, that's good.
SM: Unfortunately, most people have also been conditioned to think that thinking, and using your intellect, is sort of not holy. That feeling is God, or feeling good or just dancing.
JR: Well, unfortunately that's a cop-out, and we know it.
SM: And yet, a lot of people, and often, we have to touch people where they are. And so, they just want ecstasy, and I just try to give them a little bit of truth.
JR: I know. Here we are, with the next generation around, and you are pointing up toward 2012, 2013. A hundred thousand twelve-year-olds in New Jersey, more than half of them couldn't pass a basic writing test. They can't write! They can see, they can hear, they can feel the vibes, but they can't write!
SM: Yeah, well, that's:
JR: So there is, Scott, what I am trying to get to, we're coming up on the break here, but there is a polarization going on here, which I guess is pointing us toward that Mayan 2012 date, which is building and it is a crescendo and it is building.
SM: And this polarization will become sharper and sharper. Primarily, the polarization between those who know that kindness and helping others is what life is all about, developing ourselves and helping the world, and those who are self-centered, and those who don't care.
JR: And boy, the self-centered and those who don't care come after the kind ones, especially in schools now, and they go after those kids. They sense them immediately, and they try to damage them. They don't want to be told, they don't want to be aware of the fact that they are heading down a very negative path, many of them.
SM: Yeah, well that's where the whole, you know, use of psycho, kind of, medication:
JR: Well, psychoactive this and all of that. Yeah, exactly right.
SM: Yeah, unfortunately if you look at the way society is going, it looks like it is falling apart at the seams. And it is getting worse and worse.
And yet I can tell you that from my own research and my own experience of working with people widely, that at the levels of consciousness, which are not being picked up in the media, and people's internal lives, people are getting clearer. There is no doubt about that. Some people.
JR: [Underneath:] And that: yeah, it's probably:
SM: Some people.
JR: There you go, I was waiting for that qualifier.
SM: Not everyone.
JR: [Laughingly:] Okay. All right, take a break here, come back and a final segment with Scott Mandelker. His new book Universal Vision: Soul Evolution and the Cosmic Plan is available right now. Don't forget, his website, if you are not connected to the net right now, try to remember this or write it down, www.universal-vision.com.
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JR: Our remaining minutes with Scott Mandelker. It is a sensory world, Scott. People are preachers now of their five senses, they are captives of their five senses. Intellect comes in last, if it comes in at all in many cases.
I don't know how you can stand up on a stage and reach out, but you did, and I commend you for that. And I am sure that people heard you on a number of different levels. Now tonight, our audience is certainly, I think, the best there is in radio, these are very bright people.
We don't night after night tell them what to think but we just say to them, please do engage in the process. And they do, and they are listening very carefully to you. We have about four minutes left, and I am going to leave it to you to tell them what you'd like them to hear.
SM: Well, what I would say is that despite any and all negativity on Earth, coming from higher dimensions, despite any kind of programming or any of the challenges and pains of our life experience, we always have the power within ourselves to be free, to heal our mind, our emotions.
We are the master of our own destiny, and the quality of our moment-to-moment consciousness is really in our control. And that's really what life on earth is all about -- developing greater awareness of the quality of our moment-to-moment experience.
We can always bring in self-love, acceptance and kindness, and we need to find the meaning of our lives -- individually and collectively -- and then we'll know the purpose of life. And then, much, much will become clearer about our purpose on this planet.
JR: I really like the expression "moment to moment consciousness," and that we do have immediate, instant and total access to the qualitative type of experience that we have.
Now, what about: one thing I want to get to, and I have this written down in my notes to ask you. So many people sense, and this I think dovetails into many of the things that we have talked about in the hour and a half, feel that time is speeding up.
SM: Yeah, I would just say that actually the richness of moment-to-moment experience is increasing. Time is basically a function of awareness. When we get deeply involved in something, time disappears. I think that what is happening is that we are having a richer life experience, individually and collectively.
This is a product, ultimately, of the planet's continuing energy shift into a condition of higher awareness, fourth density, whatever you want to call it, so that we are actually experiencing our lives more deeply, more richly, in the moment.
And there is a less of awareness of checking back with the past -- healing ourselves from our attachments in the past. We are more able to be present.
And I would say that that willingness and desire to be present fully, with an open heart, with an open mind, taking responsibility for our own experiences each moment, that is our guarantee of continued and eternal spiritual growth.
JR: People who come to you convinced they are ET souls of ET origin have problems with that. And I am just lamenting the issue of the person who takes that conflict legitimately to the wrong person.
SM: Oh, yeah, of course. It is always psychopathologized by somebody who doesn't believe in spirit, or higher dimensions, or soul. So you have to be careful who you go to when you have problems.
JR: Boy, they can lock you away after medicating you. It is real dangerous. So what would your counsel be to people, Scott, what would you counsel people who have this conflict or feeling of a duality or a different heritage?
SM: Well, the first thing is that the idea of being an ET soul is metaphysically real for some people. If it's real, we really need to know it and come to terms with it. And we have to understand that part of our emotional pain on Earth is that this is primarily a world without love.
Walk down the street, how many people can really open their heart to you in a kind way? How many people really want to help each other widely?
And certainly the mass media is not about kindness and honesty. And so, I would say again, whatever is real needs to be realized, and then realize the power that we have to heal ourselves and make peace with who we are.
JR: Well, we arrived right back to self-empowerment.
SM: As always.
JR: All right. Scott, thank you. Great to visit with you again, uh, we'll do it again fairly soon.
SM: Can we just put the website out one more time?
JR: You got it.
SM: www.universal-vision.com. And they can contact you for the mailing address, I guess.
JR: Indeed. We'll take care of it. [Link to order page here.]
Universal Vision is the book, Scott Mandelker is the guest. And Scott, take good care.
SM: Yeah, thank you very much Jeff, I appreciate it.
JR: All right. Good night.
SM: Good night.